A good read

  • User
    OVER40RUNNER
    EXCELLENT ARTICLE---- I JUST WISH MORE COACHES BELIEVED IN BUILDING A BASE RATHER THAN HAVING THEIR KIDS DO 200 METER SPRINTS ON THE 3RD DAY OF PRACTICE
  • User
    sp63545
    @OVER40RUNNER
    Agreed! Ideally, you have a kid start in 7th grade and the first 3 or 4 years are this type of work. Then when they get to their JR/SR years, you start to sprinkle in some of the interval training. The problem comes when you have kids that aren't very motivated and you can't trust them to run by feel and push on the hills. This is definitely something I am going to experiment with and see how the kids respond, both physically and mentally.

    My last question is why aren't there more training threads on this board? We should all have the same goal of advancing SC running. Shouldn't we all share ideas, experiences, etc...? Just a thought
  • John Olson
    Site Admin
    Insider
    hyperionxc Edited
    @OVER40RUNNER I told you to contact me if you have an issue. And do not keep posting this on the forum these posts. Do not post any more on the forum about complaints. Complaining does not help the sport and takes away from time of doing our best.

    As for training topics, the ones I have deleted have not relevance to someone asking how they train, etc. A forum is for discussion, asking questions -- not praises, etc. I will always stand by that method of using the forum. No one is perfect and I do read and enjoy having open discussions to people and we also need people to subscribe to even keep the site updated to help share news of what athletes are achieving in this state!

    posting on this website is not something people should expect to have without maturity and understanding, as we are told throughout life - use it as a privilege. If you don't get it, ask me in person or email me.
  • User
    Insider
    jodicel
    @sp63545 I would like to see more training discussion and I thought the article was very interesting because it discussed an alternative approach.
  • Drew Harris
    User
    TheWU
    I'm not sure how radically different or sans-speedwork (as people have been saying on letsrun) this actually is. He's doing 8x30 second strides three times a week...that translates roughly to a 8x200s so I feel saying there is no speedwork is not really reading into whats going on. That being said, North Shore definitely gets results.
  • User
    sp63545
    @TheWU
    Agreed! I think a benefit though is that the kids may not see it as "speed work" and so they won't try and hammer all of the time, something every coach deals with. In my experience, kids don't "race" each other during this type of work. However, you get out there with a watch and give them splits, it turns into a race or they just try and run faster than what you tell them. The other side of the coin is you get a group that's not motivated and everything turns into an easy run. I guess that's where the art of coaching comes in.

    What works for North Shore may not work for ________________________. There obviously has to be some talent in the equation. We can't be afraid to try a "new" approach though. If you develop the aerobic system early (5k is ~85-90% aerobic) then I don't think we can really go wrong...
  • Coach
    Insider
    Alsoran
    More miles = more strength. More strength = more speed endurance. I have yet to meet the runner who went from low mileage to moderate or high mileage and got worse. And if they did, they were also flogging themselves at running too many hard track intervals at paces way faster than goal pace over short distances with too much recovery time. Not all coaches agree with this viewpoint obviously. Makes for a good debate, though!
  • Drew Harris
    User
    TheWU
    @Alsoran
    I heavily agree with this, often I think some coaches over complicate things. Getting to college, I feel I have gotten the most improvement from adding more weekly mileage and general aerobic running (tempos, steady states). Hopefully I can get a full spring and summer of healthy training in for once this year.
  • User
    sp63545
    @TheWU
    Now that we are getting back to high mileage, the US is becoming more competitive. When you have 5 and 6 college athletes running 3:57 or better in a single indoor meet in early February it's apparent that something is working. In my opinion, it's the return back to higher mileage, year around training, which starts in high school. My goal as a coach is to develop them and prepare them for success in the future. Some are concerned about injuries with high mileage but I think to much intensity is the more serious concern. Its better to be undertrained than overtrained and injured. I refer to what Steve Magness said in reference to increasing LT: Push the LT up as opposed to trying to pull it up.

    I too think we often times try and make things too fancy and complicated. We try and duplicate the workouts that the elites are doing but forget that they have been doing this for 10, 15, and 20 years. Keep it simple, develop the aerobic system, and learn to race. Is this type of training perfect for every kid? Probably not, but nothing ever is.
  • Drew Harris
    User
    TheWU
    @sp63545

    The mile has taken off the past couple of years, just in 2007 the season best outdoors was 3:40.x by Manzano, a 3:40 (converted) may or may not even get you into the INDOOR finals this year, let alone be near a season best. In terms of frying or overworking younger runners, I feel there is a much greater chance of doing that with heavy interval work. As long as you build up smart, recover (ice+stretch) and get the proper rest, I think even high schoolers can work into the 80-90mpw range safely.
  • Steve Conway
    User
    Insider
    SCA_Coach
    I wonder if any of this is based on Lyle Knudson's system. He was the girls coach at Florida when I ran there and had what seemed like crazy ideas, but apparently he was ahead of his time as I've heard he is sort of a guru now.